Photo: Pavla Kopecna

Some found their way through the band’s archetypal artwork, while some through their perfectly descriptive name (which came about from a children’s book, it turns out). One thing for sure, The Pains of Being Pure at Heart reached their audience thanks to their honest and candid songwriting—which also became home to many Indonesian listeners, apparently!

That last point was one that was brought up thanks to the short chat between Kip Berman, their frontman, with Jirapah’s Ken Jenie and Mar Galo. The two, being bands that stood the test of time (you can see how apparent this is in their convo), talked around topics like the current NYC music scene, the balancing act between day jobs and music life, to the band which captured their fascination, Geese.

Ken & Mar: Your band has been around for almost 20 years now. That’s amazing! Looking back, what do you think of the songs you wrote in your earlier days? And what do you want to write about now? 

Kip: It is amazing that you mention that, because yes, our first show was March 2007 at Peggy’s Birthday Party, so I think that’s almost 19 years this spring. It’s interesting, because when we started our songs were reflections of things that happened in the past – trying to make sense of growing up and all the confusing and thrilling and weird experiences of youth and young adulthood. 

I think in some way, that question of “what do you write about now?” as your life changes is one that, in part, led me to make different kinds of music and stop doing PAINS for a while. After becoming a parent, so many of my ideas about myself and the world I lived in shifted – and I needed a way to express that all in a way that was just as different as the life changes I felt. So, that music I made as The Natvral sounds – very different than what came before in PAINS. 

And now, I’m writing some new PAINS songs and they’re also different, with more direct language — they have that big sweet jangle that bands like Teenage Fanclub, or Big Star did so well – maybe even Oasis, hahaha? They’re still loud and noisy and full of big feelings.

Ken & Mar: I watched you perform in Jakarta over a decade ago (it was fun!). Since that was a while back, what do you remember from that first visit, and what are you looking forward to this time? Any extra days here to sightsee or try some local food, perhaps? 

Kip: It was truly one of the best times we ever had, coming to Jakarta. You have to understand that when we started, we received more messages from fans in Indonesia than anywhere else – it was so unusual. Of all places on earth, it seemed like our music really connected with people in Indonesia, despite it being such a different place, language, culture, and history.

So we always wanted to have the chance to come and play. And the last time, there was a bit of a technical issue with the sound system at the venue – so it’s possible that maybe the sound was less than ideal? But that doesn’t really matter, because the kind of music we play is more about feeling and our own imperfections, and not being afraid of that. 

Ken & Mar: What is the music scene in America, or specifically New York, like these days? How has it evolved or changed since you started out? 

Kip: It seems there’s actually been a kind of resurgence of bands that I think are pretty cool. There’s a young band from Chicago called Sharp Pins, which is really just this 19 year old named Kai who dresses beautifully and anachronistically and makes these jangly powerpop songs that seem so beyond his years. And there is a scene of bands happening there that dress like 60s mods and play slightly psychedelic jangle pop – and that’s really fantastic, I’d say.

Good Flying Birds is a new band from sort of the middle of nowhere in Indiana, that’s kind of a punk jangle pop band. Also, nearer to where I live there’s a Slumberland Records band called Lightheaded that’s really good, and another one called Jeanines, who both write really concise, direct pop songs. Of course, these are all pretty underground artists. 

Maybe the most “NEW YORK” indie band right now that’s actually quite well known is called GEESE. But I was first really moved by the singer’s solo record, Cameron Winter “Heavy Metal.” When I first heard it I was sending it to all my friends and not even sure if it was as brilliant as I thought it was. It’s so weird – it’s like Will Oldham, if Will Oldham looked like Julian Casablancas. He’s also really young, but sounds like he’s from another world, another time, and another age. 

Ken & Mar: What movie or film do you think best represents your band? 

Kip: Clueless!

Ken & Mar: Your band broke up because of feeling disconnected (according to Wikipedia), then got back together around last year. Can you describe what that disconnection felt like, and how you found your way back into it? Glad to have you performing again, by the way! 

Kip: It’s not quite that. In 2016 I became a parent and my life just changed so much. I was home with my daughter full time til she was about 2, then my son was born and I was home with him. I just didn’t feel like the life that I was in before was something I could return to – or even that I wanted to return to.

I was still writing songs, but it was coming out really differently. I made two solo records under the name The Natvral – Teathers (2021), Summer of No Light (2023). I really felt more connected to that new music, as it felt connected to my life as I was living it. But around 2024, my children were a lot older and I got an email asking if PAINS might be up for playing some shows in Spain. And I asked the others, and they were all excited by it too – and it just felt like there was no good reason not to do something we loved doing and that people wanted us to do, so we said “yes.”

And from there, other people asked if we’d play some shows – and so a few more things started happening. I really don’t have a plan for any of this, except to try to do cool things if we can. I guess that’s kind of a plan, hahaha.

Ken & Mar: How does one sustain being a musician? Does everyone in the band still have day jobs, and what tips would you give to aspiring bands and musicians on how to keep it going? 

Kip: If you love music and care about creating it, you can always keep making music. No one can stop you from that, so long as you have an instrument and a song you want to sing. It doesn’t mean you can always play shows or put out records or even have people care about what you’re doing — but you can always sing a song. 

As for us, yes, everyone in the band does other things too. When I’m not doing PAINS, I work as a pre-school music teacher (I sing with kids from little babies to 5 years old in a couple nursery schools near me) and I also work as a substitute high school teacher. 

 

 

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We love this clip because it is totally us at practice, can you relate as well? Lol 🙂

Haha! Yeah, I think that’s super funny! But seriously, it’s cool we get to be in PAINS before we start feeling too many PAINS.