Text: MM Ridho, Garrin Faturrahman, Nugie Rian
Photo: Whiteboard Journal/Nugie Rian

For his maiden voyage to Indonesia, Kamaal Williams had his sights on just how intriguing this country can be: the kindness that is the standards of Indonesian treatment, the architecture of local mosques, up until… adzan breaks (Maghrib, Isya, or Jum’at prayers, for instance).

We wouldn’t have known about all of these if it weren’t for the brief interview we had with him down in a spare room lent to us by the folks over at Joyland Festival. There, our interview quickly expanded into some sort of an spiritual forum (an Islamic one, that is), along with a lively conversation on his musicianship, and the things he celebrated in life as a Asian-British mualaf, a person with the birth name of Henry Wu.

What do you think about Indonesia, by the way?

I love Indonesia. It’s It’s my first time here in Jakarta. And yeah, I love the vibe. I always wanted to come here. I love it. I love to hear the adzan.

We watched you play in Zodiac. What do you think about the show?

Oh, you watched me at Zodiac? Yeah. It’s very cool. Very glamorous. I don’t know how to describe.

You’ve been known to play contemporary jazz. How do you perceive the current state of contemporary jazz?

You know what, I don’t really worry too much about contemporary jazz, I just focus on my music, make the best music I can make to share with the world. I don’t try to worry too much about everything else.

But would you say technology has influenced the contemporary jazz scene? Particularly in terms of your music production.

Well, look, with me, you know, I always just, try to find new ways of making music, to keep inspired. So, every time I make a new record, I have to do something different whether that be use different instruments, different musician, different synthesizers. There’s [so] many different ways to make music. And the most important thing is that you know you have to work with what. You have sometimes only have one keyboard and one laptop, and you have to make music. And you can’t make music with this sometimes. You have a hundred musicians, you have a big studio, you have an orchestra that you can make but whatever you have is about being resourceful to make the most out of whatever you have.

This contemporary jazz we’re speaking about often takes another genre into the mix. Like, for instance, we can see some post-punk band adding a bit of jazz in their music. What do you think about this genre-bending and genre-fusioning experimentation?

You’ve always got to experiment, you know. You always have to just try to make something fresh and that will always involve your inspirations. Me, personally, I grew up listening to many different type of music. So, I’m not gonna make one type of music. It’s gonna have the influence about many things. I don’t make jazz [music], you know. I love jazz but I wouldn’t call myself jazz musician, because the best jazz musicians, like Robert Glaspoor and Roy Hargrove, were the best jazz musicians—I’m not at this level. But what I am is a producer, musician, combine everything together, and this is what I do. So, I try not to call myself one thing. I just pretend to be Kamal Williams and Henry Wu for house music.

Is there any bands or musicians in this spectrum you are looking up to?

I love Andre 3000 recently. His album is very very nice and pushing boundaries but in the UK I love Cleo Sol, Westside Gunn, and Roc Marciano.

Do you happen to have a connection with Floating Points?

I know Floating Points. But connection… If you give me Wi-Fi password maybe we can make it haha.

I met him before, yeah. You like him?

Oh, Floating Points? I like him, especially his project with Pharoah Sanders.

Yes, I went to the Hollywood Bowl to see.

Oh, the live Hollywood Bowl orchestra?

Yeah, with Miguel Atwood-Ferguson, who plays on my album. Oh, If you listen to my new album, have you heard my new album?

Stings? Yeah, it’s very nice. 

It has me go out with Miguel on there as well.

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So, how do you engage with audience who may be new to jazz?

You know, like today, for example, I just try to be myself and just talk to the people here. Look, when I came to the stage, I know I see many hijab today. So, I know there are muslims in the crowd. So, I say Assalaam-alaikum,

Wa ‘alaikum salaam

Maybe, many people today, they didn’t know jazz but they like Assalaam-alaikum.

Do you think a music festival dedicated to jazz should be necessary?

No, not really. I like Joyland. It’s a good festival.

Why do you like Joyland?

Because there’s lots of rain hahaha.

Kamaal’s manager: Rainland festival.

Rainland festival! Hahaha.

But I know I like it. Everyone is so nice and I love the people here. The energy is different. It’s nice and, you know, to be in a country where we have to stop when the Maghrib comes in, when the Isya’ comes in, when the Jummuah comes in. This is nice as well there’s a respect for our culture.

I have respect for our culture. I’m also a Muslim. There’s many nice festivals all over the world, you know, New York Jazz Festival and North Sea Jazz Festival, you can go see many great jazz musicians there. Many many great jazz musicians.

I guess in this country, there is a jazz festival that’s not really jazz. More like… pop and blues, but none of them are pushing boundaries. Not like you guys in the UK who are just often pushing boundaries.

How about Java Jazz Festival? Where’s that? Where’s that in the scheme of things? Is it very purist? Is it contemporary?

It’s a blend of all of them, but lately what I’ve seen with what Java Jazz’s doing is like incorporating pop acts into it—to sell it.

Kamaal’s manager: Yeah, it’s interesting because you know, New Orleans Jazz Festival are booking like Ed Sheeran.

Yeah, everyone is doing that everywhere, you know? But it’s good.

It’s quite diverse, but not pushing boundaries. Anyways, have you found a good place for Friday prayers?

Well, there’s a mosque right here isn’t it? The one next to here. I don’t know what the name is. 

Al-Bina?

Al-Bina. But I heard about the Istiqlal mosque.

It’s the largest in Southeast Asia. Maybe you should come down to Indonesia specifically on Ramadan. Like during almost the time of breaking fast, there are a lot of street vendors selling weird food that you would never get before probably.

Yeah. That’s nice. I learned that very nice.

I have a question for you now. I want you to recite one surah from the Quran for me each!

[The crew’s reciting one short Surah (or the only ones we remember)]

Your time now!

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Now, has any of the surahs from Quran inspired any of your works?

Always, yes. For me, one of my favorite surahs is At-Takatsur.

اَلۡهٰٮكُمُ التَّكَاثُرُۙ‏ حَتّٰى زُرۡتُمُ الۡمَقَابِرَؕ كَلَّا سَوۡفَ تَعۡلَمُوۡنَۙ‏ ثُمَّ كَلَّا سَوۡفَ تَعۡلَمُوۡنَؕ كَلَّا لَوۡ تَعۡلَمُوۡنَ عِلۡمَ الۡيَقِيۡنِؕ تَرَوُنَّ الۡجَحِيۡمَۙ ثُمَّ لَتَرَوُنَّهَا عَيۡنَ الۡيَقِيۡنِۙ ثُمَّ لَـتُسۡـَٔـلُنَّ يَوۡمَٮِٕذٍ عَنِ النَّعِيۡمِ

See what this means? The worldly things, the material things will chase you to the grave. Don’t be too worship money or material things because the desire for material things will chase you to the grave.

This means a lot to me. To remember that when you have nothing, you always have Allah. Sometimes Allah will take things away from you, and you remember that Allah is always there. It’s not important to have money. Sometimes you think, “I don’t have no money” but you look somebody else you see on the street, you know, they have food, you have family, you have things to be grateful for.

I think that’s all. Thank you!

Thank you. If I don’t see you again in Jakarta, I’ll see you in Jannah.